Prepping or Self Sufficiency?

**Morgan101** · 05-16-2012, 08:10 AM

It is very comforting to see we are all on the same page. I have also worked two and three jobs at a time, and still do. I had a really nice career for 20 plus years, and then I got RE-ENGINEERED. Started over at 42, and had to work three jobs to put kids through school, and keep my house. Never collected unemployment. Never complained about having to do it. My wife stayed home and raised the kids, as it should be. Times were tough, but we made it. Along the way one of those jobs was cleaning out toilets, but what I had to do pales in comparison to CountryGuy. Just as a funny side note, I was working in an injection molding plant at the time. A very close friend owns the business, and helped me out. The point being, you do what you have to do to take care of your family. You don't sit on your butt waiting for someone to take care of you.

CountryGuy, you are sooo right when you talk about participation trophies. OMG!! Wasn't that part of the learning experience from sports: learning how to be a good loser? If you did your best, and you just got beat, well then shake the other guy's hand and say congratulations. You were the better man today. I will keep trying, and learn from my mistakes, and try to get better. We have entire generations that have completely lost this lesson.

My favorite analogy which I really like to use with liberal students, teachers and academics: You are in class, and there is a test on Monday. This test will be 100% of your grade. The high achieving student takes all the books home on Friday night. They don't go out. They study 100% of the time. When the test comes, they get 100%; a perfect score. The slacker never cracks a book. They party all weekend. Show up for the test late, and get a 60%. They fail. Now Mr/Ms Student -Teacher - Liberal: Do you take 20 points from the High Achiever, and give them to the Slacker. Now we all have 80, so everything is O.K.? DO YOU THINK THAT IS FAIR? I would like to see how many students want to give up the grade they earned, so a slacker can get by doing nothing.

**101airborne** · 05-16-2012, 10:59 AM

Originally Posted by Nikefan

I think of prepping as getting ready for an event, stocking up food, batteries, ammo, supplies, gas, and just preparing. I think of Self-sufficiency living as having a garden, chickens, fishing, goats for milk or dairy needs or meat, a non-grid power source in general taking care of day to day needs. I have prepared and learned and still learning how to do things that I or my family can do without the help of an outside source.

I agee self sufficency is the ability to provide for YOURSELF with food, shelter, water and such to live with having to depend on minimal outside sources for supplies. While prepping is using whatever means you have home canning, store purchases, scrounging, whatever to get togethr and store supplies for a bad situstion.

**CountryGuy** · 05-16-2012, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Morgan101

My favorite analogy which I really like to use with liberal students, teachers and academics: You are in class, and there is a test on Monday. This test will be 100% of your grade. The high achieving student takes all the books home on Friday night. They don't go out. They study 100% of the time. When the test comes, they get 100%; a perfect score. The slacker never cracks a book. They party all weekend. Show up for the test late, and get a 60%. They fail. Now Mr/Ms Student -Teacher - Liberal: Do you take 20 points from the High Achiever, and give them to the Slacker. Now we all have 80, so everything is O.K.? DO YOU THINK THAT IS FAIR? I would like to see how many students want to give up the grade they earned, so a slacker can get by doing nothing.

Not long ago I heard a talking head on the satellite radio talking about this exact thing. Supposedly a college prof actually put this into action in his class after students commented on how great redistribution is. He supposedly offered to do an experiment similar to what you described, take all the students grades and average them for the class. The first test comes and typical good students study and get good grades and slackers don't and middle of the road minimally study; everyone gets a B. Yeah it works! Second test - enthusiasm is down among top students, middle of road say i might as well not work so hard as I can get not much worse grade by not studying so slack like the slackers; everyone got a C. By the third test the Top say to heck with it why bother to study as I'm going to get a poor grade and middle road and slackers say the heck with it, the Top can cover for all of us; the entire class failed.

Nanny state in action. Here is the mentality of the libtard progressives (lets call them what they are Socialist/ Fascisits/ Communists) and the "99%" idiots down at your local Occupy protest and the handout recipient class down at the welfare office and sadly about 49% of our working age adults have this same mentality.

**Mangler** · 05-16-2012, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by CountryGuy

In my industry right now there are a lot of companies looking for machinist and such but most young kids don’t want to do some menial, dirty blue collar job, or at least that’s how they see it.

The only "guarantee" of a job was knowing you can take your resume out the door and get a job somewhere else tomorrow.

Another excellent post.

I teach at a technical college. It used to be called a vocational school. Now we check your spelling and grammer, so we are a college. Our programs cost half to two thirds less than 4 year degrees. Our graduates are getting great jobs. In fact we are struggling to get the students to finish some degrees, because they get such great offers after only one year.

I just don't understand why parents still insist on sending their kids to 4 year colleges. Our graduates are done in two years, have much less debt, get started in the workforce sooner, and have great careers. It just baffles me.

The health care graduates are guaranteed employment. Our IT grads are starting in the mid $30K plus benefits. Machine tool and welding grads have multiple job offers months before graduating; with signing bonuses.

You said it, having skills on your resume that you can take out the door is the only guarantee of getting a job.

**Mangler** · 05-16-2012, 05:59 PM

Originally Posted by dalewick

What do you consider to be the difference between Prepping and Self Sufficiency?

Excerpted from the introduction of Tiny Homes: Simple Shelter, by Lloyd Kahn

"In Shelter we wrote that self-sufficiency was a direction, not an attainable goal. The idea was to do as much for yourself as possible. Not plowing with horses, or growing your own wheat, or making your own shoes, but doing something within the context of your life: remodeling a house, creating a studio, building a table or bed, fitting in things like a productive garden or chickens or homemade bread, or lettuce and chives in pots on the windowsill.

It's a tightrope act, finding the right balance these days, between work for others and work for yourself, between creating things with your hands, and buying these things from others. Just like finding the balance between sitting at a computer and physical activity. These are complex times.

Interestingly, here we are in the midst of this electronic revolution and you still need your hands to build a home. Your computer isn't going to do it for you. It's comforting that not all the skills of the past have been superceded..."

**Zeke** · 05-16-2012, 11:21 PM

[QUOTE=Mangler;77130]Another excellent post.

I just don't understand why parents still insist on sending their kids to 4 year colleges. Our graduates are done in two years, have much less debt, get started in the workforce sooner, and have great careers. It just baffles me.

Because the parents want their kids to get a job that they don't have to get dirty, but wear suit and tie. So they spend the extra money and time to raise another mucher.
Those labor jobs r not for their kids.

Zeke

**dalewick** · 05-16-2012, 11:39 PM

[QUOTE=Zeke;77197]

Originally Posted by Mangler

Another excellent post.

I just don't understand why parents still insist on sending their kids to 4 year colleges. Our graduates are done in two years, have much less debt, get started in the workforce sooner, and have great careers. It just baffles me.

Because the parents want their kids to get a job that they don't have to get dirty, but wear suit and tie. So they spend the extra money and time to raise another mucher.
Those labor jobs r not for their kids.

Zeke

Zeke, Not every kid that gets a BS degree is a "mucher". My oldest daughter got here degree in Aerospace Engineering and was working 2 years before she ever graduated. I have a BS degree thanks to holding onto some schrapnel for uncle sam, and I've worked hard my entire life. Everything I have, I've earned. It's not college that makes them mucher's - it's how their raised!

Dale

**CountryGuy** · 05-16-2012, 11:43 PM

After the service the only reason I went to college was that the State Police changed their requirements to where even as a vet you had to have a yr of college credits and non vets an Associates degree. Anyway once I started looking I heard about my major and statements like 100% placement after graduation and highest avg starting salary of any of the university's programs. I was like sign me up. and for me it has worked out well. Other guys I know have floundered and several ar in jobs they don't use their degree in and could have bypassed college all together.

Some companies can make having a degree a must which is stupid. You have to have a degree or a Master or PhD, your GPA needed to be 3.8 or better... blah blah blah Well good, you end up with someone that's book smart and/ or tests well but they can't hold a conversation with anyone or have the ability to work with others in a team environment. Way to many brains (and not just engineers) that should be put in an office cube in the basement with their computer and not be allowed to interact with others. Some of the best engineers I know weren't the ones with the high GPA but they had common sense, mechanical aptitude and ability to reason in the real world. Can't always be said of the basement dwellers...

I saw friends in school that were in majors like business, accounting, MIS, etc... majors that ended up getting them jobs with salaries in and around 25K while it cost them 40-60k of debt to get their diploma. Again all those long days, nights and weekends I spent in the engineering and computer labs while they partied add up at the end of the day. Heck I was making high 30's before going to college working road construction. On the flip side, as I was in a degree with demand, when I graduated I was making quite a bit more than double their salaries and it hadn't cost me anywhere near that much. Admittedly I had GI Bill to help cover some of the cost but I also only borrowed the absolute minimum I needed and instead worked and went to school to get the extra money I needed to pay my bills.

When I'm asked by people, and I frequently am, what I think their kids should go to college for the first thing I ask them is why do they think they need college? Does their kid even want to go or are Mom and Dad living vicariously? Why do they need to go to "that" school if another is as respected but has lower tuition or isn't out of state and there fore has in state tuition rates. I also don't think there is anything wrong with a kid taking a year or so off after high school. Let them get a job and a clue before they decide if they do want to go and if so what they want to go for. I saw way to many kids after a yr or 2 change majors once or twice and quickly a 4 yr degree was a 6+ proposition. or ones after 1, 2, even 3 yrs decide they couldn't cut it and drop out. No degree but 3 yrs of tuition to pay back! Also many students borrow the max they can get instead of only the minimum amount they need. Most times I usually end up recommending little Johnny or Suzzy consider trade schools for things like plumbing, electrical, auto mechanic, CNC machinist, etc... or that they think about the medical field. To the ones that think they want to be a Dr, why? Go be a PA or an RN, in the case of a PA they learn a large chunk of the same info but don't have to do all the additional schooling & residency which takes several more yrs and loads of more money. Why not get your PA or RN, get out of school having spent less, go to work sooner and start making money sooner where otherwise be burning more time and money doing a residency to get your MD. While the MD burns thru time and money and yes some make decent starting salaries, they also get more headaches when they get out with additional costs of testing, certification, malpractice insurance etc...

Maybe we should all be politicians. I mean after all, who in their right mind spends millions to get a job that pays 100-150K? That math don't compute! Oh that's right they are there doing it out of their sense of duty, nothing to do with the book deals, speaking fees and pocket lining corruption.

**Mangler** · 05-17-2012, 09:47 AM

Originally Posted by CountryGuy

I also don't think there is anything wrong with a kid taking a year or so off after high school. Let them get a job and a clue before they decide if they do want to go and if so what they want to go for.

Please let them take a year or two off. Frankly, if the kid doesn't have the ambition to complete the applications, FAFSA, and screening tests required to get into college they are not ready for college.

College is not about having the ability to learn. Hell, anyone can learn anything given enough time and access to the Internet. College is about developing the personal discipline to learn at an accelerated rate, in a specific format, and be able to communicate what you learned to others.

**Zeke** · 05-17-2012, 08:34 PM

[QUOTE=dalewick;77201]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Zeke, Not every kid that gets a BS degree is a "mucher". My oldest daughter got here degree in Aerospace Engineering and was working 2 years before she ever graduated. I have a BS degree thanks to holding onto some schrapnel for uncle sam, and I've worked hard my entire life. Everything I have, I've earned. It's not college that makes them mucher's - it's how their raised!

Dale

I didn't mean to imply all. Sorry, for the wording. but a lot do. My wife has one masters and almost completed her second.

Zeke